Planning Board Meeting

I think I did one early on. You may have. You you may have.

Alright.

• Thank you. So I will call the Village of Croton on Hudson planning board meeting for Tuesday,

• October 7.

• First item on the agenda is a public hearing.

• '25

• our Croton Riverside LLC, 25 South Riverside Avenue amended plan for three story

• multifamily building.

• Come on up, guys.

• Last time, how are you doing? Good evening. Good evening. Evening. Go ahead and introduce yourselves and Ralph Rossi with

Croton Riverside LLC.

• Yep. Phil Spagnoli with Croton Riverside LLC. Okay.

• And

what can you just give us an update on what's changed since the last time we got together?

• Nothing. Nothing. Okay. Good. And

• and and I know that we had asked for some updates to a landscape plan Correct. That was submitted.

• Basically Right. To

Show the arborvitae in the back. We had a meeting with the with the residents in the back about a month ago going over the placement of the arborvitae, the height of the arborvitae, the screening of the arborvitae,

• and I reflected that on the plan here.

Yes.

Excuse me. Could you speak into the microphone a little better? I I indicated that on the, yeah, I indicated that on the plan here. I also submitted the email follow-up to that meeting with two residents in the back indicating

• what we plan on doing in the back as well with the arborvitae.

Okay.

That was a follow-up to the meeting we had

• September September 16.

Right. And I think you presented that last time, and then we had you actually Correct. Put on the plan so that we had it memorialized for

• Right. For the

approval. Correct.

So, Ralph, on those Arborvitaes,

• I think the the initial planting size is, like, 48 to 56

• tall when they first go in.

How tall will they No. These are actually eight to tens. These are large. On top the of the wall are we talking about? No. No. There's no wall. They're they're

• at the property boundaries. So if you if you zoom in at the top Okay. Behind the Thames property,

• they're all eight to tens.

Of those Those two groupings up there. Two groupings. Yeah. Those are the ones that you've met with the neighbor. Correct. Those are the only ones that were modified. This is what they would like to see. Correct. You agreed to Correct. Install those per The location and the height was

coordinated with the neighbors. Yes. Okay.

And then the ones at the top of the retaining wall, just yeah. Right there. Never change. Those are the original. Same.

And they're again, they're gonna be Those are not arborvitae. They are

Those are in a those are in, like, a pocket that's lower than the top of the retaining wall. Right. Those are down below. The the neighbors in the back won't see those. Those are really for

the residents. So you don't have a big massive wall in the back and you green the wall up. But those are I don't know what they're called. They're

• Willow wood. Willow

that. Wood. Wood. Oh. Viburnum. There

• you go.

So those will not go No. Up into the No.

Tall height. The the top of that planting is about

• 12 feet below the top of the wall. So the wall in the back, you see that tiered area? Yes. The rear wall is about 12 feet taller than that planting bed.

• So they're basically screening that wall. So if you're looking at it in plan view, they're just really softening up the wall, not

• they're not meant to do it for the for the apartment residence. Correct. Yeah. Correct. Correct. Gotcha.

Alright.

• If you're looking to green that wall, have you considered and I don't know what type of plant it is or how it gets planted, but I know a lot of developers use it. It's like a vine Yes. That's planted and hangs down. Have you considered using that? Yeah. Yeah. From the top conclusion?

We haven't decided yet, but we're leaning towards doing it because we wanna get the grading in the back done first. Phil and I were speaking about it more than once. We were debating whether they're growing it from the bottom up or from the top down. If we go from the bottom up, we'd have to put, you know, wire to grow up. But there's I talked to the landscaper about it. That's not on the plan here, but, again, that would be aesthetic for the tenants of the buildings. So we can now look the wall. But, again, to your point of greening up the wall Correct. Which is a comment I've heard a lot, you know, around town.

It'd be a nice way to treat what is otherwise

• Right. You know, a Concrete wall. Yeah. Not attractive view. So

• is is that

• is that something you would consider committing to paper?

• What do you think, Phil? Yeah. Don't know how

• whether it's top down or bottom up, but yes. Okay. Thank you.

What's the vine? Just out of curiosity.

I I'm not a plant expert. I would be

way off. Any suggestion, Nikita?

• Okay.

I don't know how it's usually used in. It's an IV. There's a particular A particular thing. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. It's a form of IV, but not IV. It's something else. Mhmm. Okay.

• Gonna add that to the plan then. I think it depends on whether or not you're trying to grow up or trying to It would be easy to go from top down. I already had the conversation with my landscape architect when they were out there, and he threw a name at me. And I was like, alright. Fine. We'll revisit it when we do the planting, but I Good. I didn't take mental. Sounds like it would be a nice idea for

• That's what we're all about. We try to Yeah. Augment even if we don't have to.

May I ask a question about above the wall there where it says

• area above the wall to be restored and seeded with a native wildflower mix?

• It's quite a jungle up there now, isn't it? It's like

Well, we're not we're not going beyond

• we don't have any landscape plan to go beyond where those arborvitae are. There. It's pretty much, like you said, a native

• jungle because that's

• steep slope, so we didn't plan on It's outside of our dist disturbance. It's outside of our disturbance area, so we

• didn't plan on doing anything. We've trimmed the trees and trimmed the bushes there to clean it up, but we are not doing anything up there. In fact, that whole area, if you continue

• off to the right

• to the south,

• there's

• it's all the same behind the medical building up to the rear neighbors. It's all the same type of growth. Invasive vines and Yeah. And junk. Yeah.

Right. So is that what there is now in the area you're gonna restore,

• or what what what is what is there right there? Yeah. So in the area south

or rather east below the arborvitae,

• currently, that's graded. We're gonna be seeding that with grass wild grass.

So it's bare right now? Right now it's bare. Correct. You got it. Correct. Yeah.

• Okay. And then all the stuff, then there's just a no man's land up there. Basically, it's gonna stay like that. Correct. Got it.

It's rough. I may have missed that. The the seating is gonna be done, like, in the area above the parking lot, essentially, that really steep slope where right now it's barren.

• Yes. That's where the the seating's gonna rest. It's been seated already. That's right. It's already seated. That's it's gonna be stabilized? Correct. Okay. Correct. Gotcha. Thank you.

• So just a quick question about the entrance,

• the handicap entrance entrance coming from the street level. Mhmm.

• It's a the difference in gray between the sidewalk and the built entrance

• is pretty substantial. Yep.

• And, again, just walk us through I come in with my wheelchair.

• How might when I come off that sidewalk,

• the entrance to buildings were good eight feet six, eight feet higher. How how do they get up that?

Lift right there. So where the arrow is located,

• you wheel right in up up that walkway. That walkway has no more than a 2% grade. You get to that doorway,

• which is inside of a it's not really a shaft. It's an enclosure. It's not a elevator shaft per se. It's a three sided enclosure.

• You open up the door. You there's a button there. You open up the door, and the comes down to grade. You open the door. The door is activated by the button. You open up the door. You pull your wheelchair onto the platform. You hit a button. You go up one level,

• and then the gate opens up at

• the landing

• going into the building.

Okay. So that's all stainless steel or something that can be out outside? Correct. Correct.

• And

then a pedestrian or somebody not in a wheelchair, how how are they getting to that front entrance? Stairs right there. So the same walkway, when you walk up to the front of the building, there's a a set of stairs to the right. Yep. You either go up the stairs or you go up the lift. Okay.

And will there be some grading from the sidewalk to the building? How are you gonna do that? Quite a bit. Yeah. If you look on the elevation here at the building,

I I can't zoom in, but I think it's 28

• at building flat. 28. Right? And going down to the sidewalk, you're roughly 22 to 21 at the sidewalk.

• But you're about a 24 foot depth that occurs over

• 22 to 24 feet.

• So will it be some grasses, landscaping? All landscapes. So if you go to landscape plan, that whole area, that's right here. Mhmm.

So you have planting with a border, and then we have grass in front of that. Mhmm. And the and the change from the previous plan, as I understand it, is everything to the north

• of where that sidewalk enters up into the building That was the ramp. Was a very large

• handicap ramp that

• is was

• substantial because it's going up that six to eight feet that would

• it has to switch back several times. And and and and this way,

• as I understand it, that's now a sloping landscape

• Yeah. Correct. Area that I

• feel would be an improvement over the big ramp there that Before, it was a big massive concrete. I mean, people just

• I can't imagine you

• I I hate those ramps because they're they're impossible. Back and forth like For an actual handicapped person they use unless you're motorized. Right. Right. Would

it be possible for us to take a look at the original

• landscape rendering

• that was proposed?

• It's gotta be a couple years ago. It should be in the file. Now. It's here. Might be cheaper. It's

• not in the work folder of our

website? No. We

were looking at it last month over I mean, it's nice. Yeah. I I would just like it'd be nice if we could share it with people at home so they can see

• as nice as that was, it's being improved. It's being improved. Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot less concrete. Side. Right. If we have it, it's one leaf. If we don't, that's something else. 25. Yeah.

And now

• planning for nine sixteen.

• On.

• Got it. From there. Open twenty five seven. Original. It's resolution.

• Mhmm. See, original.

• It's gonna be one.

I already have that one open.

You know what? I'm gonna close this.

• It's 20.

And this.

Going down.

• This, I think, is what we got.

Yeah.

Okay.

All I have is Well, you can see the volume of the ramp there on the front of the property and the and the amount of land that it actually took up. Yeah. Mhmm.

• That's just with the site. I mean lands. So

• that area would not be landscaped, obviously. Right. It'd be hardscape of of ramp and

and then, you know, pretty substantial railings that go with those railings. No. It's it's definitely an improvement. I just wanted to

• share the original with people if we could. But Yeah. If it's not in the computer files and

• Okay. So be it.

Well, we can dig around for that a little bit more. In the meantime, we

• need to call for a public hearing on this project. So if

• Eva, would you like to make a motion to open a public hearing?

Motion to open a public hearing on the amended site plan application

• for Croton Riverside LLC.

Alright.

• Do you a second there? Second. Okay. All in favor? Aye. Aye.

• Alright. So

• is there anyone from public that would like to

• speak on behalf of this project?

• Okay.

Having heard no one, would you wanna see if there's any written correspondences that we wanna oh, okay. Do we have any written correspondences regarding There was one. There's an email from Lauren Davis. Yeah. You wanna just summarize that? Or

you wanna take a pen?

Is your top record? I don't have it in front of me.

Just talking about,

• essentially,

• plans for a party space on top, and they decided to go ahead with that even in the face of much protest

• and promised there would be nothing that would be visible from the back of

• Van Wyck.

• And

• well, you know what? I'll just read it. Dear Karen, thank you for being so helpful to me regarding the notice of public hearing before the planning board scheduled to take place at 8PM on Tuesday, October 7. As a neighbor of the South Riverside project, I am skeptical at best that amendments to original plans will lessen the impact on those of us who live above this project.

• The village government and the developers decided it

• was a done deal when they introduced the

• survey several years ago.

• They never listened to the over 70%

• of respondents who said they did not want a big building back there. They went ahead anyway.

• The developer took me on a site tour before they broke ground and promised nothing would be visible from

• at the level of the back of Van Wyck. This was clearly a lie.

• Initially, there were no plans for a party space on top, but they decided to go ahead with that even in the face of much protest.

• For the duration of the building that has gone on thus far behind

• thus far, my home has been filled with dirt.

• My upstairs office shakes every time they do something with the backhoe.

• In the beginning of the construction of the retaining wall, they began their pile driving without an appropriate company to monitor the vibrations.

• I don't know

• that there was a an accurate site specific environmental impact study done.

• Why would

• you think any of your neighbors would trust an amendment to your plans without having adequate time to review

• detailed accurate plans of what they're planning to change? It is unfair and inappropriate

• and not very neighborly to or kind to ask us just to come to a meeting and protest changes

• that you're going to make anyway.

• Karen Stapleton

• kindly explained to me that drawings would be available perhaps before the Friday

• before the Friday before this Tuesday meeting. Does that really give us adequate time to review what's happening? I don't think so. That's from Lauren Davis

• at 14 Hamilton.

• Thank you.

• So

• any other correspondence? No? Okay.

• So in that case, I would entertain a motion to close the public hearing. Motion to close the public hearing?

• Second. Second. Okay. All in favor? Aye. So

• I think that the I mean, personally, I'm just open for discussion here with you guys. I think that the proposed

• I mean,

• project's passed, project's being built, the project's gonna open,

• and

• and the proposed changes that are being

• brought forth at this time, I don't think have any impact on sort of what was

• discussed in that in that email. In my opinion, it's a

• it's a approved project that

• I believe the changes that are being proposed are improvement to the the overall plan. So

• I I I would certainly be in favor of

• of of a resolution to pass the

• plan as amended.

Yeah. And I would just add

• that the letter is talking about the back of the property and this the changes were made to the front of the property

• for

• for a view from the street,

• except for the Arravaiti, which you the the

• developers have just

• met with the two people behind there about.

• So but other other than that, the changes are

• the changes are for Street View.

Any other thoughts or comments, guys? No. Okay. So we do have a draft resolution before us,

• which

• has

• list out the plans as as amended

• and

• given to us and talks about the

• following conditions

• for approval that the improvements

• agreed upon in the neighbor agreement are detailed on the plans.

• And I think that the updated site plan

• is is listed here and it's been updated to include the

• neighbor agreement. And certification

• for the new wall will be required

• before a certificate of occupancy is issued.

• I I don't have any other

conditions about the the changes that are being proposed. Well, I'd like to have a some kind of note added about the ID to the landscaping

• in the back.

Something would you like to propose some language for that? I'm

not sure of the exact legal language, but, you know, whereas we also would like added

• something resembling ivy, whatever

• term is for that type of Planting treatment. Plantings. Mhmm. So as to further

• green

• the rear wall. Okay.

That sound okay with you guys? That's fine. Okay. Mhmm.

And it should be added to the

• landscape documentation.

Thank you.

Okay. That's being added as number three? Yes.

So something to

• you got a little something there? Okay.

• So, basically, greening of the rear wall with additional plantings and and having that added to the

• to landscape plan.

Any other thoughts or comments, guys? Just like to ask, when did this job start?

I think that the

• start

• approvals or

submissions or the idea of construction, everything came before the board to talk about it. I think they would know.

When did you guys first come? Got it there early. Seventeen, I was. Seventeen? No. No. Here to the board for planning board approval? Board of trustees or the planning board? 2021. Okay. '21. '21 was planning board approval, and you were It it was here. We were here no earlier than latter part of '20.

• Right. 2020, and then got the approvals in '21.

That's it. I just wanted know because, I mean,

• a lot of people didn't show up to a public hearing.

• So it's just they had

• four years four years opportunity to come in and voice

pro, con, or whatever it is. Right. Right. Okay.

Jeff, you wanna make a motion? Sure. Motion to approve the amended site plan for Croton Riverside LLC

• for the property located at 2127

• South Riverside

• with the three conditions

• as discussed.

Second.

Second. All in favor?

• Aye. Alright. Thank you, guys. Thank you.

By the way, do you have any idea when you think you'll be finished?

Yeah.

• It should be the November latest. I mean, we're planting we plan on planting in a couple weeks. That's why we're here. So People moving in early December with any luck? Yeah. Luck, hopefully. Okay. Thereabouts. Thank you. Good luck. Thank you. Alright.

The next item is a new business item, referral from the village board of trustees

• to review draft local law

• introductory

• number 14 of 2025

• to permit the village board of trustees to appoint an alternate member to the planning board and

• and zoning board of appeals

• for the term of one official year.

• Is that meant to be the same person that would be

• the alternate for both places? Different.

• What's that? Two different people? Person for each one. Okay.

• And and I presume that's

• in case someone is unavailable for that meeting, and then you would have a stand in alternate person. Or if somebody Yeah. Or if somebody's refused.

Because Or someone's refused. Yeah. Okay. Somebody at the ready.

Yeah. So if if there's somebody who could just give us background, some context about how this came about

• as a proposal

• for this. I don't know if there's somebody with the expertise to speak to that.

What? Oh. There we go. We got somebody. Len Simon, deputy mayor.

Chairman and and members,

• this is, something that,

• came up after,

• observing

• that a number of communities,

• actually, most of them in in the surrounding area have alternates for their planning board or their zoning board. And so we thought, that's something worth considering,

• for us, which is why it's before you now to get your get your views on it. The the idea is that the the mayor with the board of trustees approval would appoint, an alternate,

• to this body for a one year term. The alternate would sit with you at, at every meeting,

• but, only vote when there was

• one of your, existing members,

• in absence. So you would always have five votes for for every measure.

• And, the the alternate would, would be,

• like a normal member except they the alternate would not vote when,

• when,

• you had all five members present

• and and accounted for.

• It's also a way, you know, frankly, of just getting some some more people involved in the planning process,

• and in the zoning board process.

• I think this this board, I think, from my just having, you know, sat in those seats for, you know, quite a while is,

• is very good about always having a quorum. The zoning board from time to time,

• you know, is is has some difficulty in doing that just because, you know, mostly because of travel

• by

• by some of their five members. So that that really was was the intent to

• to always ensure that there's a there's a there's five votes

• to,

• get

• somewhat

• aligned with what, many of the other communities are doing and to give give some other folks an opportunity to get involved,

• in this case, very tangentially

in the, in the planning process. Would the sixth person be allowed to participate

• during when there's a full

body in terms of asking questions or I think so. Yeah. That's not specified in the in the text, but I I think that's that's reasonable,

• because

• and and I think it's reasonable in a sense that you

• there's a premium on that person being well informed.

• And

• questions are one ways of becoming, well informed or participating in the process.

• And

• the that that question

• may be asked when there's five members here, but two weeks later, when you're actually voting on something and it's the same issue,

• that person may need to vote. So I think it's reasonable,

• but I think that's something that has to be determined.

I mean, by comparison, it may be a rough analogy. Certainly, when there's a a jury trial, the alternate jurors do not get to vote or participate. They're just there as backup. Right. So that's what that's the reason for my question. And, again, the alternate never votes unless someone is missing. Right. But I've I've put questions in a in a slightly different category. Have there been any studies of any kind or analysis

• or anything like that to evaluate

• whether,

• this

• is a good thing for villages and municipalities?

No study that we've seen, but, just the the empirical evidence that so many of the other communities,

• do it, I think, is is probably,

• probably the best evidence that that, it's a it's a reasonable thing to do.

I would just mention that a difference between the jury and

• this position is that the alternate jurors are

• obligated to be there, whereas this is a voluntary position. So I think it

• it would be advantageous to make it as attractive as possible. So I think getting to ask questions would be

• would be,

more attractive than just having to sit here. Sit there. Right. Yeah. Because there there there is, an expectation that they will be present for every meeting. Right.

That's valid.

So I do have some reservations.

• You know, we're doing this because other communities do it.

• I guess not necessarily because we have some attendance issues,

• but rather because other, communities do it.

• The the concern I have is that adding another person to sit up here who's asking questions

• can potentially steer the discussion

• in any direction

• and then

• is not at the end of the day, is not responsible a vote. Right.

• So I

• you know, I'm happy to have someone sit in and watch and and be informed

• and

• kept up to speed however they do that. Whether they do it physically, they do it at home.

• But, I have some serious reservations about having somebody

• that does not vote,

• having the having the potential to dissuade discussions.

• And

but that's just my take on this. No. I I have some concerns too, Jeff. I mean, I I

• I'm very mixed about this. It seems to me it's kind

• of a solution looking for a problem, particularly in our board. I mean, I know, just personally,

• I miss maybe about two meetings a year on average, maybe three now that I'm traveling a little bit more. It's not like I'm out 15 times a year, nor do I have that observation about any of you. We generally have a full board. Sometimes people are sick. That happens.

• I

• believe the zoning board has a little bit more of an issue with that from what I'm told, but I don't monitor their meetings to be able to say that with any scientific data.

• The other concern I have is that somehow,

• intuitively,

• they're not the the alternate isn't quite as invested

• as we are. I mean, I take here's another question. Do they have to take continuing ed like we all do?

• I don't know, but I think it'd be a good idea if they did. I I would. Yeah. At the very least, they should have to get caught up quickly with Yeah. Knowing how to do their job. Yeah. I mean, I love the continuing ed component of this. I I find it really enlightening and, you know, part of the

• fun part and educational part of being on the Planning Board is continuing to learn.

• I have concerns about

• a one year appointment because you lose the institutional memory that we all have here from being on the board for various

• tenures.

• I think that's advantageous to the village to to know what happened the last time we had an application like this and what kinds of things challenged us.

I do understand and I'll if you want Just a just a clarification on that. I my my understanding of it, you know, reserve the right to be proven wrong, but I think it's it's a one year term, but the that particular alternate is eligible to be reappointed. Oh, I understand that. I assumed as much, but, you know, we all we we are three year appointments, so it's a little bit different.

The other thing to point out is that when you have

• if you don't have the full five people, but you still have a quorum of three or four people, the applicant always retains the right to not have a vote

• at the end of their application. They the hearing can be conducted,

• but the applicant doesn't have to submit to a vote on their application

• if they have,

• only three or four people. They can elect to wait until there's a full quorum of five people.

• That's an option that's open to every applicant. So there is,

• you know, a hedge against that issue

• when and if it does arise in a

• more hotly contested application,

• let's say.

• So I too have some reservations about it.

• Even though intellectually,

• it sounds like a good thing to have an alternate,

• I don't think that person is gonna be as,

• informed or as rich,

a participant as people that are invested fully and are here every meeting more or less to participate in the process. Well, I think the those are these these are all very good points. And I think, if we do go forward with this, at the board of trustees and and and act this,

• I think a lot a lot of what you're saying, I think, become important factors on who gets selected. I think you wanna you wanna try to go for quality, commitment, and real interest in the subject matter as well as, you know, some expertise perhaps.

And I I would also just add, you know, talking about

• not just being with other communities and what's the empirical data for using alternates.

• I think

• I can't think of a a village I've worked in or for that doesn't have that provision with alternates.

• I think it's helpful

• if,

• god forbid, somebody's out, you know, for a long longer period of time, maybe three meetings or so. You really want somebody there

• keeping a seat warm at least until the the person gets back if if that happens. Happens.

• That benefits the the applicant also of this, so they're not waiting

• keep waiting for somebody to come back. You have a body here.

So

• I I can't ever remember the counterpoint,

• Dan, to that is I don't ever recall us not having a meeting because we didn't have at least three people.

• Am I do you would anyone have a different memory? We've always No. Fielded

• the hearings. I mean, from

I've seen it from time to time, not frequent, but Right. From time to time. I understand You that know, what whatever. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I hear him saying that some of that's our good luck. It's not just our dedication or Right. Responsibility,

but it's our good luck as well that none of us has been

• Out for ill and out for an extended period of time or right. And that that could happen anytime to this board. Okay.

Right.

Thank you. Thank you.

So, Ed, if you'd like to come up and give us some comments, please.

• Welcome.

You know Stick to the tone, Nick.

We just ask that, you know, we stick to the

• time limit rule and

• and,

• hopefully, comments on on the topic at hand.

On the topic of an alternate

• to your board,

• it'd be more appropriate given the absenteeism

• of the village board

• to have one alternative to the village board.

• I've gone to all three boards. I haven't attended every one of your meetings, but met probably 75%

• of them recently.

• Very few

• is a person absent or has to abstain themselves because they may be representing a client.

• You have an excellent record.

• I think part of the problem is it's sort of like and and this is is throughout Westchester

• because it's a systematic attack on zoning.

• And this this board, this particular board, has showed tremendous independence

• and a judicial temperament, which is all anybody can ask, fairness,

• more than I've seen in any other board in this village. Let me tell you that. And I think it's just another method of packing a court.

• If anybody needed alternatives, it would be the village board because of absenteeism

• on the village board,

• which is frequent and chronic.

• I can't speak for the zoning board. I've only attended, like, four or five meetings.

• If a person has a problem,

• and they've set this as policy on their other other on their other, committees,

• I think they said although they don't enforce it. If a person's absent two times, they throw them off the committee, which is unreasonable.

• But if a person has chronic problems with attending a meeting,

• they should be asked to resign

• and

• and and appoint somebody else. But there's never been a problem with this

• this board that I know of. And any of the zoning board of appeals meetings, I haven't seen a problem. I have seen a problem with the board of trustees.

• There's two two or three of them that there's two of them that are absent very frequently and and one that's been absent

• more than three or four times, which is more than anybody in this board has ever been absent.

• And the and this board is repris is a quasi judicial

• organization in my book. It's mandate mandated by this state. You act in a very professional manner, and you have a set of

• credentials

• and rules and and education

• you have to go through.

• And

• who's to say that this alternative,

• right, this this alternate,

• which I believe is a a packed position to expand this board philosophically

• because you've been independent several times,

• much to the chagrin of the powers that be,

• who's to say that that person is gonna be absent? You know? People have family requirements, deaths.

• Who knows what? So you may be just

• compounding the problem.

• What other villages do in this county

• is irrelevant.

• There are there are a number of villages that are under virtue crazy with their zoning,

• and they're following an ideology.

• That's why I have grown to respect,

• even though you I don't agree with all your decisions,

• the,

• judicial temperament on this board and the questions that are asked to this board. And somebody just brought this up

• and very appropriate. If if this alternate

• this this alternate,

• board member is allowed to ask questions,

• you're damn right they can they can bring up issues and steer debate.

• So I think it's redundant.

• It's inappropriate.

• And quite frankly, it's an insult to this board.

• If they file if they did it first,

• if they created a legal way

• to put an alternate on the board of trustees,

• maybe you'd say, hey. We'll follow along with that. But,

• there's no excuse for this. None. Thank you.

Alright. Well, I think that,

• perhaps we can

• I think that all the points brought up were super valid and

• worth considering and worth bringing to the attention of the village board?

• And I think if we can craft a memo back to them

• that just talks about the points that were brought up tonight, I think it would be valid and worthwhile

• to to respond.

That would be great. Would we have the opportunity to review that before it gets forwarded to board of trustees? Yes. We can do that. That'd be great. Yeah. No problem.

Alright.

• Any other thoughts on that, guys?

Agree with what you're saying. Okay.

I do know that I mean, having attended the

• zoning board a couple times recently for

• another for an application that they they did have an issue with having

• a full board both the times that I was there recently. And

• and I don't think it was to the benefit of

• the applicant that I was

there for. Could you be more specific? Did they have three or four instead of One meeting, they had three. Another meeting, they had four. And did come to a vote in your attendance at either of those meetings?

The application was pulled in on the first meeting because

• it unlike our board, we a simple majority here works. Right.

• So if you have three people here and two people vote for it and one person doesn't, you pass. If you have four people here and,

• you know, three people vote for it and one person doesn't, you pass. Right.

• With the zoning board, if there's a if it's a five member board,

• unless you get three votes, regardless of how many people are there, you don't pass. Right. So it has to be a majority of the board.

• So if you only have three members there, then Jesus. And you look like you're not gonna pass, then you

• the only prudent thing to do is pull your application. Sure. That's not that's not consistent with the planning board, though. I didn't say it was. Oh, it was different than He was he was contrasting the Yeah.

• So,

• I mean, I think it's actually,

• you know, more

• and and and and I I agree that I don't think we've had issues with attendance in this board. I mean, very few times this have been

very few times there's been less than four people here. Are you saying that it's more based on what you just said, what I'm hearing is it's actually

• if there's any potential benefit, it would be more beneficial for the zoning board than the planning board? A 100%. Interesting.

• I think that's worth noting in our memo

• Yeah. That maybe you know, there's I don't think there's anything that says we have to do this for for both. Maybe our recommendation might be, it makes sense for the zoning board based on our discussion,

• but less so for all these reasons for the planning board.

I would I I think that's accurate.

• And I don't know about the village board if if they should I mean, that's statutory, I think, in terms of how they operate with

• their membership.

• I don't think we can even comment on that because it's not really within our Yeah.

• You know, sort of area of influence.

Yeah. And I I the other point that was brought up was just about getting more members of the community involved.

• And there might be other ways to do that, than putting somebody else up here.

• And, you know, maybe it could be with getting more people involved in the in the zoning board where they're starting to learn a little bit more about municipal law and everything or

• other opportunities,

• other creative ways to get more members of the community involved, but I'm not sure

this would be the solution for that. Yeah. I happen to know there's vacancies on a great many

• voluntary

• boards in town, and Mhmm. Those are always good stepping stones to serving on something like the zoning or the planning board Mhmm.

• To your point. Yeah.

• Alright. Terrific.

So we'll get something together for Amendel.

• Thanks.

• So we all we have left is the approval of the minutes of oh, you do have one more thing. Oh, please. That is the draft letter to the trustees about the power plan fees. Oh, okay. Did I see that?

That was that was circulated by email. Uh-huh.

• Wow.

• And

• I did not see that. I think I missed it too. No. I mean, it was it was sent around. Karen sent it over. I understand. Believe you. And and, Steve, you you commented on that. Yes.

• You commented. So let let me read it. Somebody said this this is look perfect.

Oh.

• I was distracted by the Yankees losing. Sorry.

I can read it if you guys would like. Yes, please. Please. Thank you.

So, yeah, so this would be the draft that was circulated

• on our behalf that would go to the the village board.

• Date, September 26. At its regular scheduled meeting on September 2, the planning board discussed payment

• of a a recreation fee in lieu of Parkland in accordance with section two thirty dash one twenty three b of the village code for the construction of new buildings.

• As currently written, the planning board has the authority to determine if the applicant should pay a recreation fee or not, but, no discretion as to the amount of such fee. In the case of accessory cottages,

• the current fee for a two bedroom cottage

• is $8,000.

• There is no recreation fee considered for an accessory apartment of the same size. Given the modesty of some accessory,

• cottage applications,

• the planning board is requesting that the village board consider

• granting the planning board some leverage,

• when imposing fees

• for accessory cottages.

Thank you. That does trigger my memory. Yes. I think that's appropriate.

So that's

• I think some Dan put together on on his last day.

• And

• Karen

• put together. I

• don't did he? I mean, I was in his office on the last day, the last minute,

• and he was was sweating over that one.

• But don't the

• reservation I have is on this last sentence. Planning board's requesting the village board consider granting the planning board some leverage

• when imposing fees. Maybe leeway, latitude? Leeway. You know what? I'd I'd I'd keep it black and white, and

• either

• we impose it or we don't.

• Mhmm.

• And to that, going one step further,

• I would say that the fee for a cottage

go away, period. I agree with you. And I was surprised to actually see that it was written the way it was. I thought that that I thought that that's what we had been talking about in our discussion. Not that we wanted discretion, but that we thought it was

• discretion.

• Yeah. All of the above was discussed.

And Yeah. Right. So they're you're you're not wrong. Right.

• However,

• I I think I would fall in this camp of,

• you not

having that. Right. Because by definition, an accessory cottage is modest. I think I mean, it has to be with this the size. More than 800 square feet according to our criteria. Right. Right.

And having to come up with a reason why

• every time they shouldn't have to pay it is not something that I wanna entertain. Change in '32.

• Awesome.

Thank you. Thank you, Jeff, for bringing that back. Everything.

Okay.

• And

• then moving on to the minutes

• from September 16.

I wasn't here, but can I mention three

• silly grammatical things? Okay.

• Page one,

• third to last paragraph,

• end of the second line, when the trash is collected.

• Okay.

• On page three,

• Karen,

• one, two, three. The fourth paragraph, it starts off Jeff Hanes.

• The second sentence just it starts off

• with a lowercase. It's

• looks looks like there's a word missing.

Yeah. I think that whole thing should be stricken. I think that was your notes, Karen.

• Okay. That that was was was captured in the sentence above. That that sense beginning, on the changes of wall, do they have to do calculations,

• blah blah blah. So we covered that in the sentence above. So so, Steve, that's a good catch. And then, Jeff, is that,

you've drilled down further than I did with the last sentence and says the entire wall has been that's

that's gone too. Fine. Yeah. Great. Thank you. That's all I saw. And the next paragraph has a little one as well. They they could be they could be come in the front. Would be that in the first line there.

• Yep.

I don't have any other comments.

• No, sir. No.

• Good.

You wanna make a motion? Pardon me? You are here. I should make a motion. John, you wanna make

I wanna make a motion. Make a motion that the minutes be approved

• with the exception of the corrections that Steve made.

• And Jeff.

• And Jeff. And Jeff.

• Okay.

Second.

• Alright. All in favor? Aye.

And, Steve, you're gonna abstain? I was abstained because I was absent. Okay.

You're one of those guys that was absent. Uh-oh.

I'm gonna get replaced.

Alright.

• Oh,

• yes. We do have a discussion item.

• The

• village manager has requested

• that we consider

• moving our meetings from the first and third first and third Tuesdays

• back to what we used to be was the second and fourth,

• and

• and it has to do with personnel

• around the village. And and

• and to do so, I I believe the the zoning board would have to move them to the third week. Zoning would move to the because that was when he asked, I I said, well, that would create an obvious conflict there. And two of us are on the conservation advisory council, which meets on the second Tuesday.

So that that's a conflict that's a conflict as well. Mhmm. Yeah. So a lot of things would have to move in order to make this possible.

• Do you prefer not to? I certainly prefer not to. But

I don't have a preference. I don't have a preference.

• I'm sorry, Jeff. You said I can go either way. Whatever. Yeah. I'm saying.

I think it's Also also the same. Okay. Well, I think it's preferable for

counsel and for consultants. Oh, I see. Yeah. I think it was the planning consultant

• that we recently got Valerie

• involved

• and then

• something for with the Right. For you. With your office. Right? Yes. Correct. Alright. I'd like to make a correction.

Thursdays

the third Thursday of the month, I may have something to do. No. Tuesday. Tuesday. Tuesday. Tuesday. We're good. They would still be Tuesdays. They'd just be second and fourth. It was the

• first and third. Couple years ago. There was that ever since I was on the board until a couple years ago, yeah, when they asked us to change it. Right.

So Right. Well, it's not a big deal for me one way or the other. I just just being aware that the other committee will also have to change Yep. And hoping that works for them. Change as So

as if they can figure all that out, I don't have an issue.

When would this potentially be effective? Do you know, Karen? December is what was discussed. Oh, that soon? Yeah.

• Meaning January?

It would be the the beginning of our new year, which actually starts the first week in December. Oh. So we So I think it would it would mean that we would be meeting a week later in December and then probably not meeting for a second meeting in December.

I

guess what's interesting about that is that we will

• potentially know much earlier if we have Yes. A not not

• a meeting that month

• with the with the new noticing.

Karen, I'm sorry. You're suggesting we might not wind up with a meeting on the twenty first?

We won't have one. I'm suggesting we probably won't because there's a new submission deadline.

• Yeah. It's right. So Okay. That it's fifteen days. That would have been yesterday.

So

• just a question about procedure on that. In that example,

• say 25 South Riverside, we said, can you come back to the next meeting

• and,

• change this or change that?

• And they didn't submit those any of those changes fifteen days in advance.

• How do we handle something like that?

So we could accommodate

• a

A non zoning application.

It seems reasonable to me. Yep. I mean, we try to be accommodating people. You know? It's like because I know

• again, just to put it out there,

• the comparison to the zoning board meeting is that they are literally only once a month, and then I think they take the summers off or something like or some part of it. We take So generally. Yep. So you can be

Wow. Just like Did you know that, Jeff? I did not know that. Okay. Well but they did meet this August

• at a special request for yeah. Mhmm.

So, anyway, I mean, it's not no knocking them. Mm-mm. No. No. But

Live and learn.

It's just I mean, I know that it was suggested that this board could meet once a month, and and the hesitation about that was that, you know, I don't think we're being there for

• the community if we if we would pull back that much and then potentially

• not have a meeting.

• You know, it's a it's a it's a big

• commitment to Mhmm. Be here, and it's a big commitment to for for the community

that we are here. Right. And meeting twice a month means that, you know, you're getting out, generally speaking, by, you know, usually nine, 09:30.

• If you're having one meeting a month, you're here till, like, 11:00 if there's if it's a busy agenda.

• And, you know, at 10:00, most people work still for a living. Mhmm. You fade. You're not as sharp. You you just wanna get out of there by Right. 10:30, 11:00. So it it's not a good use of the board's time to meet this board, to meet once a month. I just wanted to say that again because I think it's important. Okay.

Alright.

• Anybody else have anything? Nope.

• Okay. Move to adjourn.