Planning Board Meeting
Right. Geoffrey Haynes had said he wasn't gonna be here. First item on the agenda is an old business item, Orchid and Elm, 36 Oneida Avenue, also known as 321 South Riverside. This is for a sign permit application. Please come up and tell us about your project and Bring an extra chair. She's gonna
Thank you. My name is Lisa Smith. I'm the person who submitted the application on behalf of Orchid and Elm. This is my partner, Lorraine De Mayo. Thanks, Lynn. My other partner, Rosemarie Melda. And what do you need to know?
the best of ways. We heard you talking about the plaza that there's been a great facelift, which is really nice for the town. It looks so beautiful and fresh, the whole plaza, the whole building there, which is lovely.
your space. That is our space right there. Yes. I was by it the other day. It looks like it's gonna be fun. Yeah. The, the landlord has some other,
things in plant, things in mind, like window boxes and landscaping and different things like that. So he's really he's trying to make it a beautiful building again. Is it a new landlord? Yes. He purchased the building in dis
And so we went to the VEB and had a review. And they had some comments. The overall looks fine. They use a handsome typeface. However, we'd ask the type to be properly spaced, kern. O and r need to be slightly tighter, and r and c need to be even more so. L needs to be slightly closer to the ampersand. These aren't knits. I would say they sound like knits, but affects readability and overall design quality. If the applicants or sign designer have questions, I'd be glad to speak with them. So that was from Jonathan Is this is what the sign has has submitted, or were there any adjustments or any based on any comments?
Okay. The flowers are. Well, I think your logo looks perfectly nice to me. I agree. Beautiful.
Do you prefer I'm sorry. That's it. I wanna interrupt. Do you prefer to use the one that we're looking at here or the one that you slightly revised and sent to Jonathan that we're not looking at?
The only thing I see, my own comment is if you go back to the other slide, I could understand intellectually his comment of the R and the C seem a little bit too far apart. To me, it's a knit, and I could, at the end of the day, care less. But I do understand that intellectually. The o n e his comment on the o n r, I don't get that at all. Right. So
Yeah. The c is curving away from the r. I get that. I mean, my own personal opinion, and I'm just one vote, if you guys are happy with your sign that's gonna be on your business, I I consider this comment a knit, and you should be happy with your own sign. I agree. My opinion. Same. Agree a 100%.
I would like to ask one question. And and not nitpicking. I'm just do this here. Letter height is 10 inches. And then on the print, says seven seven point five. And that's is that shorting you some some signage?
Want you to get what you're paying for. On the print? I'm sorry. Yeah. On on on the the face cover here. Right. What is we're we're looking at on the screen. It says 7.5 height?
Yeah. It says 7.5 on what I have here. From the green line Oh. The bottom green line, letters are 7.5 in the height in the center of two green lines.
Okay. Then I'll I'll agree with the with the other fellows here. The if if you're happy with it, I'm happy with it.
Forgive my ignorance, but what is your business? You're a flower shop of some kind?
Okay. Thank you. I intend to. Believe me. But you're not open every day, if I recall.
Do we have a draft resolution for these guys? Just a motion? Okay. So any other comments from board members? So I would entertain a motion.
All in favor? Aye. We wish you the very best of luck with your business and welcome you to, you know, do well.
Good luck, ladies. Alright. Next item on the agenda is a It's a public hearing. Mark Franzoso. 23 Nordica Drive. Minor site plan application for construction of a new home, including landscape architect plans. This is a public hearing left over from previous meetings. Hi.
Oh, you don't have it? I don't have it on this one. I don't have it. You're right. It's
The ones with the dots in the middle, I think. The ones with the dots in the middle that don't have a designation. So this one is a new one, I believe. One n s is a northern spruce.
Right? No black tupela. The plus the ones with pluses, I think, are being added.
Where's Lath? I think that well, no. That's that's an artifact from the
Right. The red oak wasn't enabled. The other one is the ness of the other one with the plus is the tupelo.
And then there's some, you know, utility. Home water system is is there, and then the east end of the left hand side of the left, looking at it on the street with with all the storm water and sewer lines coming down.
It's a full sized tree. You're worried about the root structure impinging on the wall?
If it gets if it gets too big back there between the you know, is it too close to the house? If it's gonna be a larger tree, it's really close to the house. How far is that?
So we're at one foot one inch equals 10 feet. So it looks like it's about six feet, seven feet away from the house.
Close. It's close. It does get to be a big tree. It would be something to think about.
Well, that black tubal that's going in, though, is pretty small, two and a half to three inch caliper. And then that's gonna be not a not a soup not a very large tree, I guess, if they trim it and keep it.
I mean, in the end, they are full sized trees. Yeah. It is rather close to the other to the house and the other full sized tree. To me, it's a little bit of a surprising choice for it so close to the house.
What about the dogwoods running around there that it seemed like bringing you up around the back of the slope? Mhmm. It was good. Right? Yeah. And then the Green Giant arborvitae is giving you the screening across the back because having been there now a couple times, it's it's very exposed at the back, so that should provide a nice screen to the uphill neighborhood, vice versa, eventually. There's gonna
Yeah. And the dogwoods are nice too because I think they have the people to six starting out, so they'll Right. And the people behind have an upper deck. Right? Big upper deck. So they'll be looking sort of down on those dogwoods.
And I think the preservation of all those trees between the neighbor to the the east is is a good thing. But I think I've been x ed out in the past, and so I think that's an improvement. I mean, he's done what we asked him to do in terms of a a landscape plan that seems reasonable in my opinion.
And that's there's a lot of plants, actually. It's a lot like if you look at the quantities, it's it's a substantial landscaping commitment.
Yeah. Adriana, how does this compare with not just you made some recommendations, I don't know, four months ago to the applicant. As it wasn't a specific plan. It was, you know, here's some plants that you can use. In your mind's eye, what you may have envisioned, how does that compare to what you're looking at now?
Oh, I think this is better. I mean, this was this is very thoughtful. I that was just very quick.
And I guess when they when they go to plant this landscaping plan, if that's required, that tree is required, if they get fired. At least be planted.
Yeah. Yeah. They just might want to just give some more thought to the fact that it does end up to be a full sized, a large tree eventually. Seeing ones that are as big as.
And has all of the has all the stormwater stuff been done and tied in and cleaned up?
And The stuff is clean. Has been tied in, obviously, our water system for this property. Right.
And so they did some, you know, like, contractor grass and and some stuff on the slope to stabilize it.
Some of those areas mesh that, you know, is sort of utilization mesh. That has to be for them. Right. And even even for the I think areas that it it's gonna be landscaping too, so it's a lot of it's temporary. Only the soil at this point. Do
we have a sense of timing? Because I'm gonna go back to the same subject we discussed a couple of times now over the months, which is so the Piney Point is how far away from their landscaping being put in. Does that precede the completion of the work here so that they can bring up landscaping through Nordica to Piney Point? Is that the schedule that you're projecting? Or is are they whenever they happen to get done, they happen to get done? I mean Do you know anything about that, Dan?
Well, I don't know if they're close to wrapping it up. They're making progress. Yeah. I wouldn't make that statement.
Well, I mean, you know, well, I I guess I could talk to them.
Okay. Well, I'm not sure I heard answer my question in so much as you don't know the plan schedule is what I'm hearing. No. Okay. So
I think they made a good point. I've heard they're they're trying to get at least John's house done by possible. And the question is, if they're playing properly, you know, do do they get this in the fall? Because they have to This landscape on this plan? For for Piney Point. Oh, for Piney Point. Right. But it seems to me that you'd want
again, it seems to me that you're gonna wanna bring in your landscaping materials, the trees, primarily through Nordica before this house gets installed on Nordica. Right? I'm gonna be I'm Dan, the house is not gonna interfere with bringing Is that what you were saying? That the house won't interfere with the ability to bring, hept big trees up through the property to
Okay. So are you saying It's not like it's somebody else.
Obviously. So are you saying you wouldn't bring in the the modular house on Nordica until you finish the landscaping on Piney Point?
What's the point I raised months ago? I never got an answer. There's some things that why would he have done some of the things that he did that, obviously, we didn't have good answers for going, you know, back when things started. So we mean, I think a a a plan of a plan for, you know, construction sequencing that, you know, talks about how that Piney Point is gonna get ultimately implemented and a kind of construction sequence and and something that makes sense because there's a big retaining wall going in in behind this house. And when does that happen relative to, you know, delivery of that material, installation of that material, and access to that property? Because I don't see a lot of access from above. I mean, I could be wrong, but come from here. Hey. Like, I guess the Well, we wanna pin it down though, I think, from from my point of view as a planning board. I don't wanna leave it open to interpretation or it could happen this way or it could happen that way, and I don't really know what I'm gonna do. And maybe we're gonna finish this house in the fall, and maybe we're gonna do this later. I think that that's not that's not a satisfactory answer in my opinion.
But we we raised this point previously months ago. We asked the sequencing question, and I'm kind of shocked. I'm glad you finally can't brought the landscape plan, we asked for a long time ago. I'm pleased to see that. It's a nice landscape plan. I think everybody here is pleased that it has a robust nature. I'm shocked that you don't have answers to these basic questions of, a construction sequence between the two properties. I'm just I'm astounded. It's as if we've we've we've breached this mystery of the universe. We've been asking these questions for about six months, I'd say, and you don't have an answer. Not your fault. I'm I'm not saying it's your fault, but I'm shocked that you came to us representing your applicant without an answer. I'm still speaking to those questions.
I mean, I you know, I think in in fairness to the board and and and and just like we like Steve said, you know, I mean, these questions are not new questions. And how is this you know, how does what happens here relative to what's happening up there, and how does it happen? I think we deserve answers to those questions.
I would say what what they also need to consider is finished, and they're looking to, you know, wrap up that CO. Oh, the landscaping has to be installed. If they want a CO, say, in January, the the landscaping is landscaping in also needs to consider, you know, see if they if they plan on occupying the house or selling the house.
And I don't think we you know, that that everything's done with the house and we'll put in the landscaping in the spring is gonna be a satisfactory response. I think that's super important because you at some point, you know, it's not just we'll go ahead and install the house here and figure out how we're gonna, you know, maintain access. I don't I I mean, unfortunately, this board has kinda gotten burned, you know, by what's happened in the in the whole area. And, you know, I think we owe it to the village to, you know, have answers for these these basic questions. I think they're kind of basic questions.
Yeah. I don't even know if you can get that mesh down from above. I mean, I don't know. I mean, we don't we haven't kind of gotten a full picture of how this is to go down, and I think at this point, we need it we need it.
But please be very clear in what we're asking. It's really not just a construction, plan for Nordica. It's for Piney Point as well. You're it's sort of two construction plans here. So don't come to us in you know, the next time and say, oh, I didn't know I needed both. You kinda need both. That's what we're asking for.
Oh, no. Nordica or Piney Point, you know, is under construction. They're finishing up the houses. They're gonna want a certificate of occupancy at the end. Right. The landscaping plan is part of that. Nordic, I mean, owner could say, you know, I'm I'm not gonna start this until the fall of next year. That would be his process. Spring of the year after. And that's happened before for us. So A busy so, you know, I mean, if if Mark knows where he's gonna start this, that's fine. But if he says, you know, I really don't know because I got some other projects going on. You know, the approval's valid for three years.
No. I'm saying the I the keep saying the same. Okay. Landscaping done at Piney Point is is critical. Yeah. It needs to be looked at. I'm just saying. Landscaping plan for Nordica, you know, it depends on when they when they pull a building permit. Right. And I would I would just encourage
I mean, your office will do what you deem fit, and that's fine. But one of the notes I had made on your draft resolution here so I looked through it, and I was pleased to see that on page three seven a, it says that the landscaping shown on the plan be installed prior to issuance of a certificate of occupancy. What would make me unhappy is if your office issued a temporary CO. That would make me unhappy. So I'm just saying that out loud as it relates to Piney Point and Nordica that given the history of these two jobs, they should not be given temporary COs until all the landscaping that's appropriate for their site is completed.
And and landscaping is something, you know, temporary seal. It doesn't really affect the structure, but it's part of the site plan that the structure is included with. So that that's that's a typical condition on temporary seal. Say, you know, finish the railing on the on the porch or something like that. That's a safety issue that has to be finished before we temporary seal. But it's usually landscaping, maybe, you know, paving the driveway if they have gravel down.
Well, it would it would it would be a judgment. So it's know? It'd be your judgment. Right. I would say the best thing to do would be to try to finish up the landscaping.
I think it can be done if if the site I think it's beyond the best thing to do. I think it's it should be a requirement for the CFO. I mean, it's a requirement in the resolution. I'm sure it's a requirement on the Piney Point resolution. And and and, you know, to for them to be able to wiggle out of it because it's, you know, winter middle of winter, and we can't put in the trees.
And yet, you know, we've been deal dealing with this for five years. I would say that, you know, this is the condition of board prior to certificate of occupancy that the board could just you know, temporary certificate Fine.
Think when it comes to this one, we definitely will, but I don't know what we've done on Piney Point. Yeah. Don't know what that ship may have sailed for us up there. Don't know. Again, think to your point, I think we would encourage, you know, at least the major components of it, the trees and whatnot, because it's not gonna be you know, otherwise, I think we leave this, and I'm not ready to to to act on this plan tonight because of that uncertainty. Let's let's have Dan back some detailed information on schedule for the remainder of the site 90 lots. And how does it impact, you know, what's this lot? Or what's the impact here? Because I do think that, you know, we, you know, are supposed to deal with each application on its own merits, but this application is integrally, you know, woven in, especially with the joint ownership. They're linked with the other properties, and I you can't separate them.
I think that your application should be complete. And given the history and what we've asked for previously on multiple occasions, I think it behooves you to come back to us with what we have asked for multiple times, which is a construction schedule. I don't to me, if you're answering me personally, that doesn't fix what I'm asking you to address. Well, we're asking for something easy. We're asking for a construction sequence as it relates to the two parcels. No. But what I'm saying You can make it moot by outlining that for us and how you wanna do your construction sequence.
Yeah. It has to be. It is, but it needs to be in writing. Thought out and and and scheduled. Right. I agree. Yeah.
Agree as well. Alright. So we do have a public hearing. And if there's anyone from the public that would like speak on this application, please come forward. Name, address?
Road To Pass, 10155.
But we're near finished. The other thing is the other another question I have is the landscape architect. And whoever's gonna do the plantings, are they are they gonna be the same for the Point Piney Point properties as well as the Northern properties? Do you know?
You should address us. We'll invite him to answer a question if he knows that. It's okay. Just procedural.
Thank you. I think the question may have been about the planting, whether the planting was gonna be done or something. Both the architect as well as the people who are gonna
Well, I think they'd be surprised to be able to know that, actually, at this point. And
my other question relates to that. Is there any type of warranty? Because so where I live, I'm on the Riverside. Right? When I first moved, I was very big into the neighborhood. It has a a a Riverside stream planted. Scientists actually came down to my property. I said, I want to I news or the bad news first. I said, well, give me the bad news first. He said, well, just about everything on your property is invasive, aside from poison ivory. He said, okay. The good news is that it's healthy, it's growing, and it's keeping your house from falling into the roof. Okay? And I said That is good news. So what could I do for natives? He says, it was a it was a project down by Sewer going towards Mayo's about maybe ten years ago. And he says, our planting rate in this type of substrate is 80% failure. That's why I'm asking about warranty. Because let's say so the fence also does whatever he has to do. I don't I personally don't have any faith in the contract to the owner that they that he has any long term intentions of health or whether these trees are actually gonna survive. I honestly feel he's the type of guy that will put something in just to make it look, hey. It's here. He doesn't care if he's gonna live or die. That's my personal opinion. Okay? So okay. That retaining wall let's keep and talk Piney Point. Those trees go into Piney Point. Somehow, he gets them up in there. They die. Okay? Even if there is some type of warranty. Right? This house goes up. How is he gonna how is he gonna access those trees on Piney Point that died? He's a just he's a question. That's why I'm asking about warranty.
So just to, like, I mean, just because I have a drawing in front of me and it has notes on it. And and number nine says that all plants shall be subject to the landscape architect's inspection and approval at the nursery and at the site before any planting has begun. So whether or not they do that or not, that's a note on the plan from the landscape architect. Number 10 says, contractor shall maintain and guarantee all plant material for one year from the time of landscape architect's final written approval. So and I know that that is a very standard, you know, condition of a landscape plan. So it is it is, in fact, addressed on the on the plan.
Okay. That's next question. Currently, there's there's a oil tank at Nordica Drive on that property. Okay. There's some other there's, of course, there's the tractor. I think there's some there's some other stuff there. Is any of that stuff what is that stuff related to? Is it related to the stuff on Piney Point? Or the house that's supposed to go down and and and
Big oil tank did. Because I mean alright. I mean, I guess, I don't I don't know the the what are the things. So I just I just wanna make sure that I honestly think the developer in this whole project was presumptuous about what to do. And I just wanna make sure that there's not stuff sitting down on that property that's intended for Nautica.
We don't even have a permit yet. That's all. Is it a new oil tank? I don't know. I don't wanna I'm because you can't you can't put in ground oil tanks in Westchester County anymore. So it's gotta be above ground. Right, Dan?
Well, it's it's a portable tank for the contractor for basically Oh, really? When I spoke to Anthony, he was finishing up the service and, you know, said he would remove the bucket for the excavator, the oil tank. He said he would, you know, start to clean up the site, so I'll have that conversation. Again, I I I you know, I was I expected some of that stuff to be gone gone by now. So it's just
So I don't know. I'm not against that. But that oil tank, it looks to me that it's lying down on its side. It looks like it's a oil tank for a home or something because you can see there's feet and the feet are, you know, they're like supposed to be upright, but they they have the line down. Sure. So I don't know well, any I don't think they should be in the oiling. I'm sure of that. But I mean, I don't know. And he said it's being used to to provide oil for the machine, so that means there's oil in it. Right? Is that even is that allowed, Stephen?
Yeah. I mean, it's really that's really, you know, building guy called the EPA Code enforcement? Enforcement kind of issue. I mean It's not really a planning board issue, but it it's important that you've made the comment, and it's been recorded. And and I think Dan's office will address it.
Right. The the existing Sewer work is, I guess, is related to that Dan, is that functional now? Is it connected? Is it is it is it functional?
Does it have to be because, well, there's a lot of sentiment in it already. Does it have to be I mean, considerate and I guess there'd be more sentiment than than the other. Does it have to be maintained in any way? And whose responsibility is it? It? The village or the developer?
Developer's responsibility until the village will be taking over the storm drain portion that's in drive. All the remaining portion on private property is is is private.
Okay. Because I have a neighbor. She just can't be here. You know, she had a very bad situation. Was flooding. And when you go and I just just again, I'm a novice at this thing. But just walking my door and looking down at the store, it's full of sediment. So this full is I mean, I understand there's construction going on here, whatever, but I would feel, as a resident, would be the duty to to to to at least clean that drain in before.
Alright. Thanks, Earl. Anyone else would like to comment on project? Okay. Well, since it's my opinion, at least, that we're not gonna act on this this evening. Pending some of the questions that we post to the applicant, I would suggest that we hold the public hearing open until the next meeting. I agree. And and we can close it at the appropriate time. Alright. Thank you. Have a good evening.
Thank you. So I think all we have left is approval of the minutes from the meeting dated 07/26/2022.
I wasn't at the meeting, so I can't I can't vote on the minutes, but I did notice one teeny little thing. Sure. Just quickly perusing it.
I think you can vote on the minutes, actually. Most of us most of us don't, but I think you can.
Alright. Just point of order. You know? Oh, I take back my my I read the whole sentence. I have no comments.
I have my name in here. Motion to Shouldn't we make one just in honor of Geoffrey Haynes? Because he's not here. No. He he he can make it when he comes. Alright. Motion to approve the minutes as submitted.
I'll second that. All in favor, aye. Aye. Okay. 3 is good. 3 is what we need. Kinda feel bad for Dan there getting, like, lamb to the slaughter, but that's what he's getting paid for, I guess. That's why he gets the big bucks. It's unfortunate that, you know, that we don't have a better kind of response to some of that stuff, but it's just I'm surprised that as
I'm surprised, as Earl pointed out, that the landscape architect did not come to present the plan. I'm surprised that Mark or him or both wasn't here. He keeps sending this nice fella here who doesn't know a lot. Are you really surprised? I'm not surprised. Well, I'm disappointed. Maybe that's a more appropriate statement. Know, he's got an application sitting before us. Is it a year now? Nine months for Nordica? And we've been asking the same basic question about the relationship between the two and machinery going up and down the hill. It's not a new question, and it's it's never been addressed. Yeah. I don't think it's by accident. I don't think it is either because by not having us compel him to do something, it leaves him flexible to do whatever is financially expedient for his business. And that's been exhausted. And that's that's that's fair to the village. Right.
I'd like to see the landscaping put in this fall because otherwise It'd be a whole another over to the spring. Right.
He can't sell the darn pieces till he gets the landscaping and he gets the CEO. I'm sure he's anxious to recoup money back on a job that's probably cost him far more than he expected it was gonna cost.
Yeah. I think John said that he's Mark's going to take a little more time finishing.
But that's you know, I just wanted to here or there for me. I wanna get it on the sales list or doesn't sell it. Yeah. Let's move it along and get it done.
Come come December 31 Yeah. What's there? Or not. It's getting assessed. Value is.
Not to get assessed at a 100% assessment I see. Until it's a 100% done. Right. And usually, don't get a CEO until it's a 100% done. Right. But if it's you can really have, say, the, you know, the carbon monoxide detector is not in there. 99.9% done. And it would be Thanks
The code enforcement, the gentleman mentioned a lot of sediment and and water apparently isn't going down as fast as it should because you said the neighbor had some flooding problems. That that was a different issue. That was with with some sediment, you know, coming off the property
during be be before the village takes over any utilities utilities. We inspect them. They have to be cleaned. The house makes sure they're operating properly. Farm drain system does catch basin to have sumps to collect sediment. But we clean them on a regular basis, maybe twice a year, depending on want those sumps clean before we take it over. Right. Right. That's that's when we take it over. But now But but even now Is it a Do we have something to say? And if they're, you know, more than 50% full, we'll ask that they be cleaned out now. Because if there's bit rain and more sediment coming in, they reach a 100%, everything's gonna just wash out to the the river. So we want those sumps available to remove sediment. If any sediment gets in, storm drain system. And and there's always some even from the streets. Of course. Of course. It may rain one day. Who knows? I
It hasn't rained in, like Rain? Forever. I'm not sure what that means. It's like a desert in Croton. It keeps threatening, like
Usually, when it's when they get 50% full, we we want them cleaned out. I'll take a look at it. At 50%, though, they're not actually putting sediment into the river. Oh, the if if there's They're capturing it. Right? It's a two foot sump. It's it's built up halfway, but there's still a sump that's there. And as the sump gets filled up, some of the finer sediments are not gonna settle out Yeah. And the course will. But the I mean, it's not like, oh, right at this point, if they're 50%, then we're we're dumping sediment in the river.
Sure. Of course.
Yeah. I'm a I guess I'm assuming the DPW has a regular schedule with the go around. In your envelope. Yeah. During construction
for this Sorry. Before we take it over, any time there's construction, there's always that hazard where, you know, worse sediment control department than should they're sediment control. Once it's all seated and, you know, homeowners in there and landscaping is up, then the then the sediment is just kind of a normal load from the streets and, you know, some from property because there's always sediment from property. And and DPW knows that, oh, you know, these basins, we're gonna clean them out, you know, twice a year. This one's still empty on the stream. So they kind of schedule it based on their experience cleaning out basins. Some areas of the village, they're more than twice a year because there's just rain, gravel, and items in the basin.
Well, I think the point is that it's been brought to the attention of the village now and so that, you know, Dan can direct the appropriate people to inspect it and and take action with the with the developer as required. So I I I mean, I think it's a good thing that it came to light at least. Yep. Yep. A valid concern.